[TAG] udev hosed

[Ramon van Alteren]

On 26 Oct , 2005, at 1:32 AM, mso at oz.net wrote:

> Ramon wrote:
>
>> On 25 Oct , 2005, at 10:45 PM, Benjamin A. Okopnik wrote:
>>
>>
>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2005 at 09:04:34PM +0200, Ramon van Alteren wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Using the Packages CD is nicely documented in the gentoo handbook:
>>>> http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/2005.1/handbook-amd64.xml?
>>>> part=1&chap=11#doc_chap2 The entire handbook should be on the CD
>>>> as well
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Ah-ha! I recalled seeing that somewhere in the handbook, but
>>> managed to
>>> somehow miss it on the subsequent searches - and searching the  
>>> Gentoo
>>> site for "Packages CD" gives you nothing. Thank you, Ramon!
>>>
>>
>> Most welcome. It's usually refered to as GRP: Gentoo Reference  
>> Platform
>> God knows why though, especially since they changed the name of the
>> CD to Packages CD.
>>
>
> I never could find the Packages CD or the CD of precompiled  
> packages the
> documentation seemed to hint at.  I just gave up and compiled all the
> packages the normal way.

Oh it's nice and gets you up and running with a full graphical system  
pretty soon.
But I usually compile all the stuff too.

> One trick I haven't seen in the documentation is that some huge  
> packages
> come in pairs.  So "openoffice" is compile-it-yourself but
> "openoffice-bin" is precompiled.  Same for "mozilla-firefox" and
> "mozilla-firefox-bin".
>
>
>> Agreed, I usually set PS1 differently for the chroot I'm working in
>> otherwise I get confused somewhere during the install. Normal
>> installs aren't that much of problem but the more complicated ones
>> with lots of manual configuration are a pain. I _always_ get confused
>> between all the different terminals I have open.
>>
>
> The easiest way to install Gentoo is from a working Linux system.  You
> don't even need the install CD image, just the stage 3 tarball and  
> portage
> snapshot tarball.  Then you chroot into the new system to configure  
> it and
> install more software -- I use a Konsole tab for that.  Chroot is five
> commands you have to type every time (mount, mount, chroot, env- 
> update,
> source) -- which you can't script because it crosses a chroot  
> boundary --
> but at least it's only five.
>
> I haven't had a problem with remembering which window is which, but  
> then I
> keep my tabs organized.
> (1) For short actions like starting graphical programs or running  
> 'cal' or
> 'man', cd'd to my most-used directory.
> (2) For a second project, cd'd to its directory.
> (3) A root login, in case I need to do something as root.  (It  
> stays at
> the password prompt if I never need it, and has a light yellow  
> background
> to remind me not to do anything stupid there.)
> (4, 5) For long-running programs like chroot or a web app I'm  
> debugging.

Agreed, if I was using konsole to setup a fresh install of a gentoo  
system I'd probably do something similar. Sadly I usually do installs  
on systems that are completely clean.

When using regular terminals without X I tend to get confused after  
some time especially if I have more that 5 open and some of them are  
inside the chroot and other outside of it.
The PS1 trick helps a lot and it's only one command extra.

>>> Don't get me wrong: it's a pretty nice distro in lots of ways. It's
>>> just
>>> that right now, at this very moment, it's the negative stuff that's
>>> most
>>> prominent - and _boy_ is it ever prominent.
>>>
>
> Gentoo is flexible, the USE flags are more convenient than spit-up
> packages, and it stays closer to upstream so there's less to go wrong.
> But the package query tools are unfinished.  'equery', 'qpkg' and
> 'esearch' all overlap but not completely, and each has different  
> arguments
> and output format.  Doing "I want a package that does X" usually  
> requires
> a trip to packages.quixote.org .  So it's harder to browse what's
> available than with Debian, especially since packages have one-line
> descriptions rather than a couple paragraphs.  I think there are a  
> couple
> graphical front-ends for package management that may alleviate this  
> but I
> haven't explored them.  But you have to memorize their names, as  
> well as
> the names of other specialized commands you might need.

They're definitly suffering from the rapid organic growth over the  
past year...
Some people are working on the next-gen portage rewrite in order to  
export an API so external toolbuilders actually have a stable  
interface into the package manager.
 From what I understand now it's a complicated mess and you basically  
need to be portage developer in order to produce useful additional  
tools for portage.

I use eseach package to search through the package database, it works  
similar to locate so you need to build the database first, but it  
sure is a lot faster than emerge -s/S
http://packages.gentoo.org is nice too.

> I realize none of this helps Ben while he lacks Internet access.  I'm
> sending the Java doorknob via carrier pigeon.  (Yes, Larry Wall's  
> original
> pigeon that carried clay tablets.  It's *old*, I tell you.)  It has a
> wireless adapter built-in, and the front is a curved screen that  
> usually
> shows a background image, but it comes with a Dillo browser for
> websurfing.
>

Maybe even the pigeon would improve the intelligence of the place by  
the sound of it :-)
And please don't send the gentoo handbook over on clay tablets

Ramon
--
Change what you're saying,
Don't change what you said

The Eels