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mso at oz.net
Sat Sep 3 23:54:50 MSD 2005
Benjamin A. Okopnik wrote:
>On Fri, Sep 02, 2005 at 10:33:25PM -0700, Mike Orr wrote:
>>Benjamin A. Okopnik wrote:
>>>On Thu, Sep 01, 2005 at 07:07:18PM -0500, John Karns wrote:
>>I'm not saying they *should* stay longer, although I worry about the
>>likely civil war when they leave.
>Take a look at the article that John cited, as well as the URL that I
>sent. The longer we stay, the likelier and the bloodier that civil war
>is going to be.
The article by William Odom is really excellent.
Talking about how all the major fears of the consequences of a pullout
have already happened. And asking why Democrats have refused to take
>>I'm just saying troop withdrawl should be part of
>>a comprehensive strategy, not just done blindly and piecemeal. That's
>>the "middle road" I'm hoping will emerge.
>I agree, of course - Juan Cole has proposed just exactly such a middle
>road, as well as a plan for mitigating the possible fallout for the
>locals. These are well-considered plans by intelligent, knowledgeable
>people... and I believe that we're going to leave as we did in Vietnam -
>a rout that shames us (beyond the shame we already bear as a country for
>this) and results in nothing but death and misery for any friends that
>we did have in the area.
It's good thinking out of the box, which is what we need. Funny if the
ultimate proposal comes from outside the government, but those inside
have refused to offer any, with a couple exceptions, and they've refused
to take seriously the proposals that are there.
>In Rome, those who decided that war was necessary were the ones who led
I've been impressed with how members of the British royal family serve
in the military and occasionally take up token target practice. They
may be resting on their millions most of the time but at least they
occasionally remember why they're in that role. I loved it when Michael
Moore went up to congresscritters asking whether they'd volunteer their
sons in the war and giving them a recruitment brochure--and the
congresscritters ran away.
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